Q. Did you see anything in relation to a gas pipeline on the site?
A. I don't know who pulled it out - somebody went and pulled a gas pipe out of the ground.
Q. Did you see that, did you?
A. Yeah.
Q. To your knowledge, had your men been working in that area?
A. No, I left strict instructions not to.
Q. Who did you give those instructions to?
A. Bob Campbell specifically.
Q. Were you told anything about where they had been working?
A. No, I saw them where they were working .
. . .
Q. You said, "Why would they be working - why would they be working next to the gas pipe? What reason would they have to work?" Right?
A. That's correct.
Q. What do you mean by that?
A. It wasn't part of our site. The site was handed over. We had no work to do in that area whatsoever, so why would they be working there specifically when they were warned not to go in there?
Q. The site had been handed over to who?
A. To Abi. That part - that part of the site was handed over to Abi the minute they started using it as a ramp.
. . .
Q. Did you observe the site as a whole on that side of the railway station?
A. Yes, I did.
Q. Was there any work required of Josef & Sons or their employees at the southern end of that site?
A. That's the shops end?
Q. Yes.
A. No.
. . .
Q. You said, in answer to questions from my learned friend, Mr Josef, before lunch, that you instructed Mr Bob Campbell not to go near the area where you said there was a gas pipe?
A. That's correct.
. . .
Q. When did you have that conversation with Mr Campbell?
A. When I first got on site on the Monday morning.
Q. Monday the --
A. The 4th.
Q. Of December 1995?
A. That's correct.
198 Mr Stoeski, the foreman for Josef &Sons, said of work on 4 December 1995:
Q. Were you working on the site on the day there was the explosion?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. What were you doing on that day on the site?
A. Cleaning up.
Q. What do you mean by "cleaning up"?
A. Cleaning up the rubble and timbers laying around. On the morning there's a bit of extra work on the stairs and cleaning up for the job to get out.
. . .
Q. What work was being done in relation to the batter?
A. They done it with an excavator, sloped it down on the ground. I didn't watch him how he done it because I wasn't there; I was on the other side.
Q. Other side of what?
A. The railway, sir.
Q. Are you saying the man operating the excavator made a batter?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. That was close by the gas line?
A. Well, till the end of it - it could be about 3 metres away till the end or something.
Q. When did you last see him doing that work?
A. Well, actually I didn't see him do the work. When I came back from the other side, it was already done, okay, but I was walking up and down, so I don't really - you know, can't remember that I went there or not.
Q. What was the purpose of that work - that is, making the batter?
A. That's what Abigroup wanted.
Q. For what reason? What's the batter on an excavation site?
A. I suppose so, sir, nobody can fall down into the hole. That's what I think it was for.
199 Mr Bernath Adler of Josef & Sons, responsible for demolition of the staircase to the north of the site, said, as to work that day:
Q. Are you saying that you asked Mr Campbell to leave the small material that he was digging out nicely on the batter?
A. Not digging out.
Q. That he was cleaning up, I'm sorry.
A. Yes. The material he hammered was above ground level, so we are not talking digging.
Q. How was he to leave it on the batter?
A. After he hammered, he's taking off the hammer and with the bucket clean up the area where he hammered and place it nicely on the batter, with the bucket.
Q. All right. In relation to the area between the stairs and the ramp at the southern end of the site, how far did the batter extend?
A. The same batter was extending from the red columns to the access ramp.
Q. To your knowledge at that time did that go over or near where the gas pipeline had previously been marked by the hessian bag and the other objects you've described?
A. The batter was near the hessian bag area.
Q. Was there anything to indicate that area on the day that Mr Campbell was working?
A. No.
Q. Did you say anything in relation to going near or not near that area?
A. Yes.
Q. What did you say to him?
A. I asked - I ask him specifically not to go close to the access ramp. The access ramp at the beginning of the job was in a decent condition and it became very untidy, not from our work, and I asked him specifically not to go in the area there and do any clean-up.
Q. When did you say that to him?
A. I think I mentioned it to him on Friday - on Saturday, while we were working. I don't know if I repeated it on Monday morning.
200 In cross examination Mr Adler was asked:
Q. What in your estimation is the closest the excavator got to the area that you'd previously seen the marker and tape in?
A. Shouldn't be closer than 3 or 4 metres.
. . .
Q. What I'm asking you, though, is that in that southern end of the site in the area near the ramp, was there any need to do any further battering work?
A. Battering, no - battering as such, no.
and:
. . .
A. The demolition has been completed. The demolition of the shops - they were completed. The area was to be handed over to Abigroup in order to put their ramp in . . .
201 Mr Trajcevski, a Josef & Sons labourer on site, repeatedly, in chief and in cross examination couldn't remember. His command of English was poor:
Q. Did you see what the machine was doing inside?
A. Was working but I don't remember exactly. The job nearly finished that day.
202 Mr Daniel Josef, the son of Robert Josef, was asked what work was being performed on 4 December 1995. He persistently needed assistance from a prior statement to Police to assist his recollection, even for evidence in chief:
Q. . . . Can you remember anything further about what Mr Campbell was doing on the site on Monday, 4 December 1995?
A. Well, when I was there he was underneath the steps jackhammering the footings out and cleaning that up.
. . .
Q. How was he moving it out?
A. He was breaking it up with a jackhammer and moving it with a bucket and probably loading it to a truck but I wasn't there, so --
. . .
Q. Was the excavator doing something as well as removing the foundation from the steps on that day?
A. Yes.
Q. What was it doing?
A. It was making a batter between the first - between the two levels.
Q. Between which two levels?
A. Between the upper level and the lower level.
. . .
Q. What's a batter?
A. A batter is a slope created so the - so it doesn't basically collapse, so the top level, it's cut at a natural angle of repose.
. . .
Q. Can you see an object on the batter that you could easily identify?
A. Yes.
Q. What's that?
A. I suppose it's the gas line.
Q. So where the gas line is, is that where the batter is?
A. Yes.
. . .