HIS HONOUR: Do you really think that if I tell this jury they can only use this material in one way, and that's in relation to the credit, that the jury are really going to be able to do that? The potential for this is enormous. Why it was brought in is another matter, I don't want to go down there at the moment, right or wrong. If I allow it in now, the potential of it is very strong, isn't it?
PROSECUTOR: Then I am going to be left with nowhere to go because what's happened now is - - -
HIS HONOUR: Let me ask you this: would you then be saying that they can use it as the truth of the situation and therefore it is corroborative?
PROSECUTOR: The answer is that I would be seeking to say that.
HIS HONOUR: All of a sudden it's a whole new game, isn't it?
PROSECUTOR: Exactly. I agree with that. But isn't that the risks [sic] the defence take knowing that they are going to put this? I thought my learned friend would ask that in the record of interview to have that whole matter expunged. I was waiting for it come [sic], but it didn't. I've always indicated I'm not going to call it.
HIS HONOUR: Well, you couldn't have. That's the trouble with it now. These are, even if you accept that they were made, they - the jury - descend into what I would regard at the moment as improper reasoning and accept it. Maybe once it's in, even though it can be used for all purposes, it's another interesting argument. If they use it as the truth that he made these admissions, they could never have done that, because there's hardly a clearer case of admissions being made.
PROSECUTOR: I agree with you. That's why I've never intended to use it at all.
HIS HONOUR: I can understand. Looking at it now though, because it's now raised its head, it's still in the category of confessions, effectively.
PROSECUTOR: Yes.
HIS HONOUR: They are not just admissions, they're confessions, aren't they. They really do come into the category of confessions.
PROSECUTOR: I agree. But once it's been put - - -
HIS HONOUR: Which were extracted by violence, and threats and detaining in the face of - "I'm not going to say anything, and kill me". He starts off saying, "I'm not going to say anything. He's going to kill me." But after a few slappings around for a while and a period of time and his wife's there, you can hardly find a more clear occasion.
PROSECUTOR: I agree with all of that, Your Honour.
HIS HONOUR: Well, that's what want you [sic] to address, though. You can't just say, "I agree with all of that, but we're going to belt in with it". I was asking you to turn your mind to the fact that what is the jury then told about it. How does a judge properly use it? I understand it's explosive material in your hands and also in the hands of the defence, but I suspect that Mr Steward didn't quite see this and it wasn't the way he was intending to go and he got a bit excited about it all.