"So you were just standing inside the back door of the house or a door of the house?---Yes, like the back door part of the place.
What room was that? What kind of room was that?---I thought it was just like an old kitchen or something. I can't really remember the - - -
Yes, that's where you were standing. Did you stay there or did you go somewhere else then inside the house?---No, we just went there to the door, went into that room and that's more or less where we stayed the whole time and Shirley come out from that other room. That's what I was just saying, that when I looked into that other room up there - - -
So where was that other room then in relation to where you were?---Straight opposite and we walked into the back door and I'm standing here now and the room was over there.
Was there a door between the two or a doorway?---Yes, there was a doorway but I don't think there was a door on it.
Yes, it was a separate room then, was it, not just part of the same room?---No, no. It was a separate room.
But you could see her in there, could you?---Yes, I suspected it was Shirley's mum because you could see up from a distance.
Yes?---I never spoke to the lady or anything like that. That's all I remember, when Shirley asked, 'Could you sign these papers for us?'
You said that you did not actually sign the papers in front of Shirley's mum. Is that correct?---Correct, yes.
You said, 'Shirley brought the papers down to us.' What do you mean by that? What did she do?---Shirley come - all I remember is that I never signed any papers in front of Shirley's mum and Shirley just brought some papers from her or come out of that room, sorry, come out of that room and just said, 'Would you mind witnessing these signatures for a signature of me against these papers,' and I don't even remember really - remember it being a will.
Yes. Did you actually see anybody sign, anybody else sign that will, that document?---No, no." (My emphasis)