2260/03 SEF GONZALES V AMELITA CLARIDADES
JUDGMENT
1 HIS HONOUR: Teddy and Mary Gonzales had two children, Sef and Clodine. On 10 July 2001 Teddy, Mary and Clodine Gonzales were killed at their home. On 13 June 2002 Sef Gonzales was charged with their murder. He has pleaded not guilty.
2 Teddy and Mary Gonzales made a joint Will on 23 February 1998. It made provision for an appointment of an executor and trustee. Other relevant provisions were:
"4. WE MAKE the following dispositions:
4.a Should one of us predecease the other, the entire estate of the deceased spouse shall be inherited by the surviving spouse.
4b. Should the surviving spouse die or should we die at the same time, the entire estate shall be divided equally between our two children SEF GONZALES and CLODINE GONZALES in equal shares as Joint Tenants.
3 Probate was granted of that Will to the Executrix, Amelita Claridades on 24 December 2002.
4 Of the three who died on 10 July 2001, Teddy Gonzales was the last to die. Hence, any assets of Mary Gonzales have flowed, under Clause 4(a) of her Will, into the Estate of Teddy Gonzales. No grant of representation has been obtained concerning the Estate of Clodine Gonzales. If she had any assets, and died intestate, section 61B(5) Wills, Probate and Administration Act 1898 would result, in conjunction with the Will of Mary Gonzales, in those assets flowing entirely into the Estate of Teddy Gonzales.
5 In these proceedings, Sef seeks an order that the Executrix pay him sufficient money from his father's Estate to be able to finance his defence of the criminal charges.
6 There is a principle of public policy whereby a person who unlawfully kills another person cannot acquire any benefit which arises from the death of that person: Helton v Allen (1940) 63 CLR 691; Troja v Troja (1994) 33 NSWLR 269. The Forfeiture Act 1995 confers on the Court a discretionary power to relieve against that rule of public policy. However under section 4(2) Forfeiture Act 1995, the court cannot grant any such relief when the unlawful killing is murder.
7 If it is ultimately not established that Sef Gonzales killed any of his parents and sister, this rule of public policy will have no scope for operation. If it is ultimately established that Sef Gonzales murdered his parents and sister, the effect of the rule of public policy will be that he is unable to take the benefits which would otherwise flow to him under the Will of his father. If it is eventually established that he killed his father unlawfully, but in circumstances which do not amount to murder, and he is able to persuade the court to exercise the discretion under the Forfeiture Act 1995, he will be entitled to all or part of his father's Estate.
8 If Sef Gonzales has murdered his father, the whole of Teddy Gonzales' Estate will be distributed as on intestacy. If Sef Gonzales has unlawfully killed his father in circumstances which do not amount to murder, then to the extent to which a court might decline to relieve against the rule against forfeiture, the Estate of Teddy Gonzales will pass on intestacy. There may be various permutations of results if it is eventually established that he killed one or more but not all of his father, mother and sister, or if one or more of the killings do not amount to murder. The people entitled on intestacy to Teddy Gonzales' Estate under New South Wales law are the parents of Teddy Gonzales, Mr and Mrs William Gonzales.
Position of the Estate
9 The inventory of property lodged in connection with the application for a grant of probate in the Estate of Teddy Gonzales identified property valued at, in round terms, $1,220,000. That included a house at North Ryde, and a home unit in Blacktown. As well as the assets disclosed in that application, Teddy Gonzales owned property in the Philippines.
10 At the date of the hearing, the Executrix had not completed her enquiries concerning assets owned by Teddy Gonzales in the Philippines. At the date of the hearing, the total liabilities of the Estate known to the Executrix were a little short of $12,000.
11 Advice has been received from lawyers in the Philippines to the effect that, if Teddy and Mary Gonzales had already acquired Australian Citizenship at the time of their death, there would be no need for a probate in the Philippines, but rather the Estate would pass under Australian laws, though subject to payment of certain Philippine taxes. There is no evidence in the present application concerning whether Teddy and Mary Gonzales had acquired Australian Citizenship. However there is no reason to doubt that, whatever the preconditions established by the law of the Philippines might be for dealing with the assets which Teddy Gonzales owned in the Philippines, it is the Will which he made on 23 February 1998 which will govern the disposition of those assets, if that Will is able as a matter of public policy to take effect.
12 The legal position concerning entitlement to the Philippine assets if there is an intestacy has not been investigated for the purpose of this present application. The Australian rule of private international law concerning succession on intestacy is that moveables pass in accordance with the law of the domicile of the deceased, while immovables pass in accordance with the law of the situs of the property: Nygh, Conflict of Laws in Australia, 6th edition, page 563-564. The evidence in this case does not disclose any consideration having been given, so far, to whether this Australian rule of private international law is one which would be recognised and applied by the legal system in the Philippines, whether the Philippine legal system has a rule of intestate succession of its own (whether to the same effect as the Australian rule, or different) which would be applied to the Philippine assets in the event of an intestacy, or to who are the people who would take on intestacy in accordance with the law of the Philippines.
The Work Involved in Conducting the Defence, and its Likely Cost
13 Since he was charged, Sef Gonzales has been in prison on remand. He has neither been tried, nor the subject of a committal hearing. The Crown proposes to conduct committal proceedings against him soon. The trial date for those committal proceedings has not yet been set, partly because this present application has been made.
14 The Crown brief for those committal proceedings has been served. It includes 13 volumes of written and other material, a volume of photographic material together with a CD containing negatives from 29 roles of film, 24 audio CDs of telephone intercept material, and in excess of 2,000 pages of material relating to exhibits and exhibit listings.
15 Mr Khoury, a solicitor experienced in criminal litigation, has been acting for Sef since he was charged. Mr Khoury estimates that to study all the material in the Crown brief will take at least 10 days. In addition, he estimates that there will be considerable time required and substantial work necessary to co-ordinate, order and tabulate the brief and to prepare a detailed chronology index, case outline and observations for counsel. He estimates that it will require a minimum of five lengthy conferences between counsel and Sef Gonzales to detail and work through the Crown brief and obtain instructions. His present expectation is that the defence would seek to have a substantial number of the witnesses listed in the Crown brief called to give oral evidence and be cross-examined at the committal, for which purpose an application under section 48E of the Justices Act 1902 would be made to the presiding Magistrate. While it would be for counsel to decide concerning which, if any, witnesses an application under section 48E would be made, and a matter for the Magistrate to decide which, if any, of the applications made under section 48E were granted, Mr Khoury estimates that the length of the committal proceedings would be unlikely to be less than two weeks and could well be more than three weeks. Because the Local Court usually requires written submissions when orders under section 48E are sought, it is likely that lengthy conferences between solicitor and counsel would be needed to prepare those submissions. The Crown brief includes some expert evidence. To deal with that expert evidence at the committal, Mr Khoury wishes to engage his own expert witnesses and have appropriate conferences with those experts. There may also need to be conferences with potential lay witnesses.
16 On present indications, the committal proceedings will be conducted for the Crown by Mr Mark Tedeschi QC, who is the Senior Crown Prosecutor for the State of New South Wales. Mr Khoury has stated that in his opinion:
"The seriousness of the charges and the difficulty of meeting the case alleged against the plaintiff mean that it is not appropriate for the committal proceedings to be conducted by a solicitor rather than by counsel, particularly having regard to the fact that the Crown will be represented by the most experienced Senior Crown Prosecutor in New South Wales."
17 If Sef Gonzales is not able to have his representation at the committal hearing funded by the Estate, the likelihood is that his representation at the committal hearing would need to be funded by Legal Aid. Mr Humphreys, the Director, Criminal Law of the Legal Aid Commission of New South Wales has given evidence, which I accept, as follows:
"I have been provided with a draft application for legal aid prepared by Mr Khoury solicitor in relation to the plaintiff. On the basis of the information contained in that application, if the application is made in those terms to the Commission, the plaintiff would appear to be eligible for legal aid, assuming that the Equity Division refuses to permit funds to be made available from the Estate for his representation in the pending criminal proceedings.
Any grant for legal aid made in the case would be likely to extend to the forthcoming committal proceedings."
18 He states that, in accordance with the guidelines relevant to committal proceedings in the Local Court, if legal aid were to be granted:
"… representation is restricted to the reimbursement of a solicitor only. There is a cap of two days hearing time for a single accused. The cap may be exceeded in exceptional circumstances with my approval or with the approval of the Senior Solicitor Criminal Assignments. Preparation time is ordinarily also allowed and in practice in a case such as the present three days preparation would be allowed so that a total of a five day hearing time would be allowed at solicitor rates. Those solicitor rates are $600 per day so that the total financial contribution available in respect of committal proceedings would be $3,000 and the representation permissible would be that of a solicitor only. Counsel would not be approved for the conduct of the committal proceedings and in particular the Public Defender would not be engaged for that purpose. It would make no difference for this purpose if the prosecutor was to be the Senior Crown Prosecutor Mr Tedeschi.
Up to 20 days preparation time would ordinarily be allowed prior to the trial of the proceedings. If preparation time in addition to the 5 day cap were required for the purpose of the committal proceedings it would be allowed by way of reduction from the period of up to 20 days allowed for the trial, so that it would not be funded again for the trial to the extent to which it may be used for the committal."
19 So far as legal aid for a trial is concerned, if Sef Gonzales were to be committed for trial, Mr Humphreys says:
"… it is the policy of the Commission in murder cases to approve aid for either Senior Counsel or Junior Counsel but not both. In exceptional circumstances, aid may be approved for Senior and Junior Counsel. There is nothing in the present case that I am aware of which would bring it in to the category of being an exceptional case.
It is also Commission policy that a Public Defender should be briefed if one is available. The availability of a Public Defender is, in many cases, not known until an Arraignment hearing takes place in the Supreme Court. Normally, if aid is granted, particularly if the matter is a difficult one and likely to be an expensive case, the matter will be retained in-house in terms of a Commission solicitor. That Commission solicitor would most likely conduct the committal and then instruct a Public Defender at trial. In instructing a Public Defender, we make no distinction between either Senior or Junior Counsel. There is only one Public Defender who is Senior Counsel currently conducting trial work and that is Mr Peter Zahra, SC. I am unaware of his availability and more likely than not, conduct of Mr Gonzales matter would be assigned to one of the senior junior Public Defenders.
If a Public Defender is not available, then the Commission would consider briefing either Senior or Junior Counsel from the private Bar but not both. Again, this would only be ascertained after a trial date has been set at Arraignment in the Supreme Court.
You ask advice as to the rates of remuneration payable by the Commission to solicitors and counsel. For grants of aid made after 1 May 2003, the hourly rate for solicitors is $120.00 per hour to a maximum of $600.00 per day. Fees payable for Counsel in the Supreme Court are, $912.00 for Junior Counsel per day on a refresher rate and $1,488.00 for Senior Counsel, again on a refresher rate. Slightly higher fees are payable for the first day."
20 On the basis of that approach to the funding of a trial, Mr Humphreys says:
"If for example, the trial of the proceedings took 6 weeks and on the basis that 4 weeks preparation was required, with Senior Counsel being briefed, if the matter were assigned to the private profession it would cost the Legal Aid Commission $105,000. I have calculated this at the rate of approximately $2,100 for Senior Counsel and a solicitor per day for 5 days per week amounting to $10,500 per week."
21 By comparison, Mr Khoury estimates that if suitably experienced Junior Counsel at the private Bar were to be briefed for the committal proceedings, the counsel's fees would be in the range of $2,750 to $3,300 per day (both amounts inclusive of GST). The solicitor's costs which would be charged if the committal was handled by Mr Khoury's firm would be calculated on a time charge basis, with the hourly rate of charge dependent on the qualifications and experience of the person performing the work. The range of such fees is from $169 per hour for work performed by non-solicitors (including work by paralegals, secretaries, typists and other staff) to $385 per hour for a principal solicitor.
Sef Seeks Funding from the Estate for Defence Costs
22 In September 2002 Mr Khoury wrote to the solicitors for Mrs Claridades enquiring whether the parents of Teddy Gonzales would consent to Estate assets being used to finance Sef's defence. The response was an unequivocal refusal to give that consent.
23 On 26 February 2003 Mr Khoury's firm wrote to the Executrix's solicitor notifying an intention to bring an application under the Family Provision Act 1982 on behalf of Sef Gonzales, and seeking a written undertaking from the Executrix that she would not distribute any part of the Estate until that application was heard and decided. The Executrix's solicitors responded on 28 February 2003:
"We advise that the Executrix will continue to meet current and future expenses incurred in her administration of the Estate from the Estate's funds.
We are instructed to advise that the Executrix does not intend to make any distribution of the Estate to any party who may be a likely beneficiary until your client's guilt or innocence is determined."
24 Rather than an application under the Family Provision Act, it was this present application which was brought, by summons filed on 8 April 2003.
25 The substantive orders sought in the summons as filed are as follows:
"1. A final ORDER that the defendant pay the plaintiff the whole of the net proceeds of the estate of the late Teddy Gonzales deceased, after payment of all debts funeral and testamentary expenses.
2. An ORDER that until 30 June 2003 (or further Court order) the defendant pay out of the assets of the said estate to the plaintiff's solicitors Messrs Benjamin & Khoury the amount of their Bills of Costs and Disbursements given to the plaintiff from time to time in respect of legal work done by them for and/or on behalf of the plaintiff, to date and continuing.
3. An ORDER that the further hearing of the summons be adjourned to such date as to the court deems fit."
26 On 8 May 2003 Barrett J gave directions in these proceedings, including a direction that the Executrix give notice of the proceedings to Teddy's parents. They responded by return post to the letter from the defendant's solicitor giving that notice, saying:
"Absolutely no one, neither we nor Sef, can have a claim or interest on the Estate prior to a declaration of the Australian court on the guilt or innocence of Sef. We vigorously reiterate our original position that no part of the Estate, directly or indirectly, be used to shoulder any legal expense or cost for Sef's defence.
We are one with Mrs Amelita Claridades in her pursuit to protect and to keep intact the Estate of our dear son, Teddy. We truly appreciate the effort and dedication you have given thus far to this case. Thank you."
27 At the commencement of the hearing Mr Rayment QC amended the orders sought at this stage to an order that the defendant pay the plaintiff the costs which would be incurred by the plaintiff in being represented at the committal proceedings, and, if necessary, any no bill application which might be made following the committal proceedings. The Executrix maintains the stance that she is not willing to make any distribution from the Estate until the question of Sef's guilt or innocence is determined.
Procedural Basis for this Application
28 The plaintiff brings the present application under part 68 Supreme Court Rules. That Part provides:
" Interpretation
1 In this Part -
"administration proceedings" means proceedings for the administration of an estate or the execution of a trust under the direction of the Court;
"estate" means estate of a deceased person.
Relief without general administration
2(1) Proceedings may be brought for any relief which could be granted in administration proceedings.
(2) Proceedings may be brought for the determination of any question which could be determined in administration proceedings, including any question -
(a) arising in the administration of an estate or in the execution of a trust;
(b) as to the composition of any class of persons having a claim against an estate or a beneficial interest in an estate or in property subject to a trust; or
(c) as to the rights or interests of a person claiming to be -
(i) a creditor of an estate;
(ii) entitled under the will or on the intestacy of a deceased person; or
(iii) beneficially entitled under a trust.
(3) Proceedings may be brought for an order directing an executor, administrator or trustee -
(a) to furnish accounts;
(b) to verify accounts;
(c) to pay funds of the estate or trust into Court; or
(d) to do or abstain from doing any act.
(4) Proceedings may be brought for -
(a) an order approving any sale, purchase, compromise or other transaction by an executor, administrator or trustee; or
(b) directing any act to be done in the administration of an estate or in the execution of a trust which the Court could order to be done if the estate were being administered, or the trust were being executed, under the direction of the Court.
(5) None of subrules (1) to (4) limits the operation of any other of them.
(6) In proceedings brought pursuant to this rule a claim need not be made for the administration of the estate, or the execution of the trust, under the direction of the Court.
29 These proceedings are ones which fall under each of Part 68, rule 2(1), 2(2)(a), 2(2)(c)(ii), 2(3)(d) and 2(4)(b).
The Rival Contentions
30 The plaintiff contends that, on the face of the Will, and given the undisputed facts that his parents and sister have died, he is entitled to his father's Estate. He says that if the Executrix wished to allege that he was not entitled to it because he had unlawfully killed one or both of his parents, the Executrix should allege and prove that that is what he had done - but the Executrix makes no such allegation. The plaintiff acknowledges that he has been charged with murder of his parents - indeed it is the plaintiff who has proved, in this application, the laying of the charges. However he says that, in a civil court just as in a criminal court, he is entitled to the benefit of a presumption of innocence. While there are some estate debts, of comparatively small amount, which are unpaid, he says the Executrix's duty is to set aside a fund which is comfortably sufficient to pay those debts, and make distributions to the plaintiff from the balance of the Estate.
31 The plaintiff points to the extremely serious charges which are laid against him, and to his immediate need to have access to funds to be able to meet the costs of a solicitor and counsel from the private profession to conduct his defence at the committal. Given the much less extensive legal assistance which would be available to him if he were compelled to conduct the committal represented by a lawyer funded by the Legal Aid service there is, he submits, a very strong discretionary consideration in favour of allowing his defence to be properly presented. A defence funded by Legal Aid would, he submits, be a very truncated one. While not spelled out in so many words, the clear subtext of the plaintiff's submissions is that the defence which is available on legal aid is so radically different to the defence which could be provided with private funding that it might produce a different result.
32 The Executrix submits that the question for determination by the Court in these proceedings is not who will eventually be entitled to distribution of the Estate. Rather, she submits, the sole question is whether the plaintiff has a right to be paid on the basis that he is a beneficiary, when there is an undecided question about whether all or part of his benefits under the Will have been forfeited. The Executrix submits that, as at today, she simply does not know who is entitled to the Estate. She says that Part 68 of the Supreme Court Rules does not give the Court any discretion which enables it to order or permit estate assets to be distributed to someone who is not entitled. If the result of the criminal trial is to show that Sef killed his father, and in the meantime Sef's defence costs have been paid from the Estate, the Executrix will have paid those defence costs to the wrong person. While the Executrix might be spared personal liability for having paid the wrong person, if she were to make those payments under a court order, the Court, charged with making orders which will facilitate the Estate ending up in the hands of those entitled to it rather than in the hands of those not entitled to it, should not make an order requiring distribution of the Estate at the present time, when there is a real risk that that distribution might end up being to a person not entitled.
33 To this, the plaintiff responds that to permit the Executrix to wait and see is in effect to dismiss the present application. Further, for the Executrix to sit on the fence, neither making an allegation that the plaintiff is disentitled to the Estate, nor making an immediate distribution, is a luxury which proper performance of her duty does not allow her to have.
The Presumption of Innocence
34 There are two types of circumstance in which a presumption of innocence can operate. The first is that when an issue arises in civil litigation as to whether a criminal, or seriously wrongful, act has occurred, a presumption of innocence arises: The Brisbane Shipwrights' Provident Union & Ors v Heggie (1906) 3 CLR 686 at 699; Clark v Flanagan (1934) 52 CLR 416 at 428, 429; Briginshaw v Briginshaw (1938) 60 CLR 336 at 363, 367, 372; Wright v Wright (1948) 77 CLR 191 at 210; Commissioner of Australian Federal Police v Propend Finance Pty Limited (1997) 188 CLR 501 at 546-547; Joseph Constantine Steamship Line Limited v Imperial Smelting Corporation Limited [1942] AC 154 at 192; Emanuel v Emanuel [1946] P 115. This means that the onus of proving that a criminal or seriously wrongful act has occurred lies on the party who asserts that such an act has occurred.
35 The second type of circumstance when a presumption of innocence can operate is when a question arises in civil litigation as to whether a criminal act or seriously wrongful act has occurred, and that question is not itself an issue in the proceedings, but rather a matter a resolution of which will throw light on something which is in issue in the proceedings. In that type of situation, the presumption of innocence operates so as to cast an onus of adducing evidence on the person who asserts the criminal or seriously wrongful act has occurred. It is one consequence of the requirement, in section 140(2)(c) Evidence Act 1995, that in deciding whether a court is satisfied that a case has been proved on the balance of probabilities, the court is to take into account the gravity of the matters alleged.
36 In the application I am now hearing, there is no issue to be decided about whether Sef has committed any criminal offence. As Mr Rayment QC rightly points out, the Executrix has chosen not to raise any such issue. Rather, the issue in the present case is whether the circumstances that charges have been brought against Sef, and that the Executrix does not presently know whether there are facts which justify those charges or not, provide a justification for her failure to make an immediate distribution of Estate assets to Sef, and for her failure to agree to provide ongoing funding of his defence from the Estate assets.
37 Neither is this a case of a kind where the second type of circumstance in which the presumption of innocence can arise. This is not a case where the question of whether Sef has unlawfully killed his parents is one which either party has raised for decision as a fact which, if proved, would assist the court in reaching a conclusion about the issue in the case.
38 Given the issue in the present case, the presumption of innocence does not have a direct role to play in resolving that issue. The issue in the present case needs to be decided bearing in mind that, when and if any issue were to arise, whether in criminal proceedings or in civil proceedings, of whether Sef had unlawfully killed his parents, the court would apply the presumption of innocence in the course of deciding that issue. But, in this case, the role of the presumption of innocence is no more than that. It does not lead to an answer to the issue which is now raised for decision.
The Result
39 I have reached the conclusion that the plaintiff is not entitled to the orders he seeks. That conclusion has been reached after considering the problem posed by the case in the light of several different strands of legal principle which are relevant to the administration of deceased estates. Each of those strands of legal principle leads to the same conclusion.
Nature of any Right of Sef to a Distribution
40 Administration of an estate is a process involving the legal personal representative carrying out the activities, and ascertaining the information, needed to perform the various duties of the legal personal representative. The rights which any beneficiary has concerning the estate can change, as that process unfolds. It is not at all unusual for someone who is a beneficiary in an estate to have no immediate right to be paid money at one particular point of time, but to have a right to be paid money at a later point of time, when the administration of the estate has moved to a different stage. Even if it turns out to be the case, once the facts have been investigated, that Sef did not unlawfully kill his parents, that does not mean necessarily that he has a right, now, to payment of any amount from the Estate, while the question of whether he unlawfully killed his parents has not been the subject of any court finding. To decide whether he has a present right to be paid requires an examination of in what circumstances a legal personal representative comes under an obligation to make a distribution.
41 If Sef's gift under the Will has not become subject to forfeiture, then he is a residuary beneficiary of his father's Estate. It is only when an estate has become fully administered that a residuary beneficiary has a present right of property in that estate: Commissioner of Stamp Duties (Qld) v Livingston [1965] AC 694; Official Receiver in Bankruptcy v Schultz (1990) 170 CLR 306. Prior to the estate being administered, a residuary beneficiary has a right to have the estate duly administered, even though he does not have a right of property in estate assets. In the present case, to ascertain whether Sef has a right to require a payment arising from his having a right of property, or a right to require a payment arising from him having a right to compel the due administration of the estate, requires that consideration be given to whether the estate is administered.
Whether Administration is Completed - Duties of Administration
42 The duties of administration which an Executrix is required to perform include ascertaining what are the assets of the deceased, getting in those assets, ascertaining what are the liabilities of the estate, discharging those liabilities, apportioning the burden of payment of liabilities among the beneficiaries, keeping accounts and proper records of all dealings with the assets and liabilities of the estate, delivering accounts to those entitled to them, and distributing the net assets of the estate to the people entitled to receive them.
43 When there is an obligation on the executrix, as part of the process of administration, to distribute amongst the persons entitled, it follows that the carrying out of such enquiries, and the bringing such proceedings, as are necessary to ascertain the identity of the people to whom the executor is obliged to transfer the residue is part of the task of administration. In In Re Stone; Read v Dubua (1936) 36 SR(NSW) 508 Jordan CJ said at 524-525:
"The question of what is included in testamentary expenses was examined by Harvey J in Allen v Attorney-General (15 SR 41, at 43-4). They include the expenses of getting in the testator's assets, and of ascertaining who the persons are to whom it is the executor's duty to hand over the various portions of the testator's property. Any costs incurred for the purpose of identifying these persons, whether it be occasioned by obscurities in the will or by difficulties arising dehors the will, are testamentary expenses: Re Baumgarten (82 LT 711); In re Hall-Da r e ([1916] 1 Ch 272); and (apart from anything in the will or by statutory rule provided) are payable before the residue is ascertained: Re Giles (55 LT 51). It might have been thought that when the executors' duty as to a particular thing or share was to hand it over to trustees for beneficiaries or to hold it themselves as trustees for beneficiaries, the disponee was sufficiently identified as the trustee, and that difficulties in identifying the cestuis que trust would not have constituted testamentary expenses. However, the contrary seems to have become well settled: In re Reeve's Trusts (4 Ch D 841 at 844); In re Groom ([1897] 2 Ch 407 at 411); In re Vincent ([1909] 1 Ch 810). Perhaps it was considered that the trustee was entitled to know who his cestuis que trust were, and that it was for the executor to assist him in identifying the objects of the trusts set up by the will as a term of his being expected to assume them. Further, "testamentary expenses" are not restricted to such expenses as an executor or administrator incurs in relation to the dispositions of the will. They include expenses incurred in connection with property as to which the testator dies intestate: In re Clemow ([1900] 2 Ch 182)."