I'll move to Counts 10, 11 and 12. You refer to being at [the applicant's] house at night-time. Is that right?---Yes.
You say, 'I don't have a strong memory attached to this certain occasion, but I know that the only reason I was ever at his house during that time would have been to babysit.' Is that right?---Yes.
So again, you have no memory of why you were at, you say, [the applicant's] house at night, but you believe it would have been in relation to babysitting. Is that correct?---Yes.
What I suggest ... is that you never babysat [the applicant's] child, [E], at all during 2004 or 2005. You disagree with that, do you?---Yes.
You disagree on the basis that you can recall specific occasions where you did that, can you?---I have memories of babysitting. I have memories of the events I've spoken about. I just couldn't be a hundred per cent sure that those memories are the same time as each other.
There's no possibility of finding out any date where you might have actually gone and babysat [E], I suppose, ..., is there?---Not that I know of.
No way that we could fix a time where you say you were at [the applicant's] and we could check it. No way we could do that, I take it?---Not that I can think of.
Well, I'll come back to that. I want to suggest to you that you never stayed overnight at [the applicant's] house, never stayed at his house until you house-sat his house in 2008. That's right, isn't it?---No, that's wrong.
Well, when did you stay at his house overnight, ...?
---During those years?
Yes?---I can't tell you exact dates. I can't tell you - you know, it's a very long time ago and there was no - I didn't keep a diary. There's no way for me to know.
You did babysit [E] when you were in year 11, didn't you?
---Yes.
Now, that was in 2006, wasn't it?---Yes.
I should put to you that that was about three or so occasions, wasn't it?---I can't remember. I couldn't tell you.
But on no occasion did you stay the night at his house, did you?---I couldn't tell you. I can't remember.
Isn't that something you're likely to remember, whether you stayed at his house or not?---Not when it's something that's been, you know, an ongoing event that had been going on for years. You know, I spent a lot of time since then not thinking about these things. I never knew I would have to remember every time I babysat, but I assure you I remember the important aspects.
You told the jury yesterday that when you stayed the night you remember it clearly because you freaked out a little bit that [E] was there. Is that right?---Yes.
MR HAMMILL: It needs to be put properly, Your Honour. That was in the context of [E] coming into the bed in the morning or coming in
MR O'CONNELL: That's what I'm putting.
HIS HONOUR: Yes, it wasn't precisely put that way but that's where you're leading to, yes.
MR O'CONNELL: That's what I meant. I'll rephrase it. (To witness) What you told the members of the jury is this: 'I remember' - this is p.101 line 19. 'I remember a specific time, that specific time, because I had stayed over. In the morning his son [E] came into the bed and got into bed with - and I was in the bed with [the applicant]. I remember that very clearly because I freaked out a little bit that [E] was there.' That's what you said, wasn't it?---Yes.
Now look, I suggest to you that's just fantasy. That just never happened, ...?---Well, if all of this never happened then why are we here? I have a clear memory of that because it was during those years. Your questions just previously were to do with the later years and I couldn't tell you exactly how many times I babysat in the later years but I do remember sleeping over during that time.
You, as a 15yearold girl, needed the permission of your parents to stay overnight anywhere, didn't you?---Yes.
Your parents needed to know where you were, didn't they?---Yes.
You say that you didn't lie to your parents as to where you were. Is that right?---I can't remember lying. Assuming I told the truth [sic].
You're assuming that you told the truth, are you?---There would be no reason to lie. I was just babysitting.
Weren't you conducting a sexual relationship with your music teacher?---Yes.
Wouldn't that be a reason to lie?---Yes.
Did you lie?---I don't remember lying. I am not a liar.
You asked your parents when you were contemplating reporting this matter to the police whether they could remember you staying over at [the applicant's] house, didn't you?---This was one of the points that I wanted to clarify.
I wonder if you might just answer the question for us, please?
---No, I didn't ask them.
You didn't ask them?---No. I know that at the committal hearing I said yes to that answer.
I'll just stop you there, if I may. You see, the members of the jury don't know that but we'll just go through it step by step, if we can?---Okay.
Page 18, line 1. Perhaps I'll start - put it in context, Your Honour, down the bottom of the page. Line 29, p.17. Question, 'No. So if it was the case that you were staying the night at [the applicant's] house they would want to know about it, wouldn't they?' Answer, 'Yes, they would.' Now, I pause there. The 'they' there is referring to your parents. Do you understand that, ...?---Yes.
Question, 'Yes, and you've discussed this with them, haven't you?' Answer, 'Yes.' Question, 'They can't remember a time between mid-2004 and mid-2005 that they've told you about where that happened, can they?' Answer, 'Not a specific time, no.' Now, those questions were asked of you and those answers were given, weren't they, ...?
---Yes.
They were truthful?---Yes, at the time to what I believed you were asking me and what - yes.
This is at p 20, line 9, Your Honour. Question, 'You say that that time was between mid-04 and mid-05. Is that correct?' Answer, 'Yes.' Question, 'You asked your parents whether you had stayed away at [the applicant's] house during that period, didn't you?' Answer, 'Yes.' Question, 'They told you that they couldn't remember such a time, didn't they?' Answer, 'They told me that they they couldn't really remember, no.' Were those questions asked of you and were those answers given, ...?---Yes.
Were they truthful?---Yes, at the time. I misunderstood what you were saying and I have since - reading my transcript I'd like to clarify.