58 It was the applicant's evidence that when she spoke to Mr Nassar about the proposed meeting with Mr Seller and himself at 2.00pm on 25 August 2005, she confirmed that she said to Mr Nassar "this sounds like a fruitless exercise and deja vu. Why don't you see me up here and save me the hassle of driving to Sydney?" She maintained Mr Nassar did not inform her about the purpose of the meeting. However, she believed from her industry knowledge that sales representatives know that when they are "called in", the issue at hand is serious and against the backdrop of her dealings with Mr Nassar earlier that week, she was not surprised to receive the telephone call. The reference to "deja vu" was a reference to the earlier dismissal of Jo Earley who was called to a meeting one day and dismissed the next.
59 The applicant confirmed that when she met with Mr Nassar and Mr Seller in Sydney at 2.00pm on 25 August 2005, Mr Nassar stated the issues he sought to raise with her were serious and, in response to her email, he had conducted a review of her phone records to establish why they were so high and further, as part of that analysis, he had discovered what seemed to be a serious mismatch between the phone bill and her planner entries. The applicant also confirmed Mr Nassar presented her with a letter setting out some details of the allegations.
60 The applicant recalled her responses were fairly candid during the meeting and she was under stress at the time, having been called three hours earlier to travel from Maitland to Sydney for a meeting she knew nothing about. She admitted stating words to the effect that she was sometimes lazy with her call recording, but despite this she did actually make the calls to each doctor and pharmacist recorded in her planner. The applicant also recalled saying to Mr Seller and Mr Nassar that she sometimes left home late because she had received calls from customers and colleagues. She recalled Mr Seller stating to her that the meeting was not about her making calls, but rather her honesty in recording where she was at certain times was in question.
61 The applicant confirmed that she subsequently said to Mr Seller words to the effect that "I may as well hand in my keys now. You've already made your decision" and Mr Seller replied, "we want to give you an opportunity to clarify our understanding and to shed light on the allegations against you. We will meet tomorrow morning in Newcastle before work".
62 It was the applicant's evidence that she had attempted to analyse the Optus telephone records set out in Mr Nassar's affidavit - but those attempts had been frustrated because much of the call data in question had been highlighted in a dark colour and effectively blacked out and in some circumstances, only the suburb and not the time a call was made, was legible. A "clear" copy had been received by her counsel a day or so before the hearing and she had spent 10 minutes examining those records immediately prior to the commencement of the hearing.
63 It was the applicant's evidence that while she accepted the call data presented by Mr Nassar was accurate, she had no way of testing that accuracy and further, between the meetings on 25 and 26 August 2005, she did not test the material against her planner records at all.
64 The applicant's evidence was not that on occasions she simply converted her indicative planner entry call times rather than the precise time that she actually had made the call:
Q. You say that you went to the lock-up between 8.30 and 9am. That's right, isn't it?
A. That's what it says there.
Q. Well that is your planner entry, isn't it?
A. Yes, but this is my whole point. I know there are times that I have inaccurately recorded it, not deceptively but just simply because I've relied on my memory when I put the calls in to where I've been at any particular time.
Q. According to your planner you were at the lock-up between 8.30 and 9 weren't you?
A. That's what this says, yes.
Q. In order to get to the lock-up in Cardiff by 8.30 you'd have to leave home at 8 or 8.15, is that right?
A. About 8.20.
Q. Ten minutes from Redhead to Cardiff is it?
A. Pretty much.
Q. And after being at the lock-up, according to your planner, it says you drove to Seaham and spent from 9.30 until 4.30 in the same Raymond Terrace area. That is what it says, doesn't it?
A. That's what it says.
Q. And they are the entries that you put in your planner, aren't they?
A. Mm hm.
Q. Can you please look at your Optus mobile phone records for the same date, that is 23 May 2005. Firstly, they show that you made a call from 9.05 at Little Beach. That is correct, isn't it?
A. I can't read that.
Q. Would you like a copy that you can read?
A. That would be helpful. It is completely blacked out.
Q. Do you accept that your mobile phone records show that you made a call from 9.05am at Little Beach on 23 May 2005?
A. Yes.
Q. And according to your planner you were somewhere between the lock-up in Cardiff and Seaham at 9.05, weren't you?
A. At 9.05?
Q. Yes, at the time you made the call you accept that your planner shows that you were somewhere between the lock-up at Cardiff and Seaham, is that right?
A. Well, I had to go to Kotara to pick up catering in that time, so, yes.
Q. Yes, you accept that. Now you now concede, don't you, that your planner entry of being at the lock-up from 8.30 to 9.00 is incorrect, isn't it?
A. No I don't, actually. Why is it not conceivable I went to the lock-up, went home, collected some things, headed off for morning tea at Seaham, went to Kotara, picked up morning tea, got to Seaham between 10.00 and 10.30 instead of 9.30 and 10.00 and when I converted the call I just converted what was in the planner?
Q. I am just asking you now, we are not asking for the reason why it might be inaccurate, but whether you now accept that your planner entry is not accurate for that day?
A. Well, no.
Q. So you say that you went to the lock-up, or you could have gone to the lock-up between 8.30 and 9, gone back home and then driven to Seaham by 9.30?
A. Yep. Seeing as the day starts at 8.30 I could have got to the lock-up at 8 o'clock, I don't know. I don't recall.
Q. Do you think that is likely?
A. I beg your pardon?
Q. Do you think that is likely that's what you did?
A. Well, I have done that in the past. I think what's more than likely is I've recorded the morning tea in Seaham between 9.30 and 10.00 instead of between 10.00 and 10.30.
Q. So you think that's likely to be inaccurate, do you?
A. I think it's likely that when I wrote that call up I didn't change the time. That was to the best of my recollection, the nature of this position that the call was pretty close to right so I left it at that, on that particular occasion.
65 It was the applicant's evidence that between the first and second meeting with Mr Seller and Mr Nassar on 26 August 2005 she spent no time at all preparing her response to the allegations made against her as she had other things to do. Further, she believed it was pointless as they had, in her view, already made up their own minds.
66 The applicant believed that despite a request, it was unfair that the original Optus phone records had not been given to her and accordingly, she had been unable to authenticate them. However, she recalled Mr Seller saying to her, "you have my word that it's accurate". She also recalled that he later said to her:
Our concern is not whether you made the calls, we are concerned whether you are being honest with the company and Waleed. There are several discrepancies between where you've told us that you were and where your phone records indicate that you actually were.
67 The applicant further recalled Mr Seller stating to her that the company needed to have trust in an employee and could not tolerate a situation where employees were dishonest. She admitted stating at the end of the meeting words to the effect "I guess I'm just an idiot for using my phone at those times, that's how Jo was caught in the same way".
68 It was the applicant's evidence that Mr Seller confirmed her email to Mr Nassar was the catalyst for the examination of her telephone records and had stated words to the effect that he supervised the process.
69 The applicant confirmed that upon dismissal she was paid four weeks' wages in lieu of notice. She had remained unemployed until 3 January 2006. The only work undertaken whilst unemployed was some short-term carer nursing in November 2005 where approximately $1,900.00 was earned. Her current salary was $62,000 per annum plus superannuation, motor vehicle and a potential 10 per cent bonus.
70 In re-examination the applicant stated that on the night of 25 August 2005, she felt "shell-shocked" and very upset.
71 The applicant confirmed she was given no training or refresher courses in respect of company policies and the Code of Conduct signed by her at the time of her employment. She further understood the Code of Conduct set out under Exhibit 8 was in a different format to the edition she recalled signing at the point of employment.
72 The applicant believed that given the nature of her job, it was impossible to religiously keep to the planner submitted by 8.30am each Monday, due to requests from management and doctors to change those arrangements at the last minute. It was also difficult to replicate, as required by the respondent after completing work each day, due to family commitments and after hours meetings that she was required to conduct. In this regard, she believed she conducted twice as many after hours meetings as the respondent's other sales representatives working in the area.
73 While her hours of work were 8.30am to 5.00pm, with an hour for lunch, she was rarely able to take the break and at night, there was usually one or two hours' work to be completed on the computer or writing up the day's calls.
74 The applicant confirmed Mr Nassar wrote a glowing report on her performance at the end of 2004 and the respondent subsequently promoted her in February 2005.
75 The applicant stated that she signed the 26 November 2003 In-Field Coaching Form under duress, as a result of Mr Nassar's persistence. She disputed what Mr Nassar had written about her performance.
76 The applicant confirmed she would not seek Mr Nassar's permission to be off territory to ring meeting attendees from her home phone or visit Officeworks to copy papers for distribution to doctors and team colleagues. It was also the applicant's evidence that just as on some days she could travel to Lambton and Charlestown from home and her phone would show Dudley, she could also travel from Redhead and be half way up the Charlestown by-pass and the phone would continue to read Redhead. Similarly, on some days while driving in Swansea the phone would also read Dudley or Redhead.
77 The applicant confirmed the email sent to her sales team colleagues and Mr Nassar was a knee jerk reaction to the receipt by email of another high phone bill in excess of her budget and the recognition that she only had six months to rein in her expenditure for the year. She also confirmed stating the central focus of her email was to encourage her colleagues to leave a message that she could respond to, or ring her back, rather than simply state "ring me back" as she herself was making a lot of return calls.